Feedback Focus: Ring Selection, Points Spread

[Otomo Nobuko]

I have to disagree with the x2 per sensei desired ring and the 1/2 point for exceptional raises

One: that makes the already fairly complicated math WAY more complicated for us to figure out. I'm having trouble following it right now as is

Two: the ratio of called raises to exceptional raises doesn't change so I don't see the point in lowering both like that (2 is twice 1; 1 is twice 0.5)

Three: giving double bonus to sensei desired ring makes that far too important for points which discourages those who want to use other rings for RP purposes but still have an OK chance at getting points in - particularly the events that are 1v1 with the higher point winner being named the 'winner' of the match

If spells and Kiho are that much of a difference for the smallest percentage of character types: don't allow those advantages going forward


To clarify: Shuggies should already be built -pre spell buffs- with the same kind of ring/skills equivalency as the rest of us in general. no one else is getting to use anything to buff themselves every contest.

[Vutall]

I also have to propose the question of if we are all jumping the gun here seeing as only 1 day of points have been awarded.

I understand that the longer we wait to make a change, the bigger of a gap there could be and more bad feelings can occur, but it does feel a bit too early to completely scrap my design. I personally worked pretty hard on it and thought it to be fair. Not saying that to be egotistical, or that I am opposed to change, but something to think on.

[Otomo Nobuko]

I also have to propose the question of if we are all jumping the gun here seeing as only 1 day of points have been awarded.

I understand that the longer we wait to make a change, the bigger of a gap there could be and more bad feelings can occur, but it does feel a bit too early to completely scrap my design. I personally worked pretty hard on it and thought it to be fair. Not saying that to be egotistical, or that I am opposed to change, but something to think on.

The only change I think you need to make right now is the +7 for correct ring choice so that anyone who uses the 'correct' ring and somehow doesn't get any other points, will pass gempukku

[Iuchi Prashant]

I only disagree in that school techs are always active, so anything that affects a particular area will benefit courtiers/ bushi. Battle Maidens for instance get a flat + Honour for all attack rolls' - that's a +6/7 at least for at least all rolls in two events.

I don't think that's a problem at all, mind. People will be better in some areas, and that's how it goes I guess.

[Vutall]

I personally think players should look at those who they will be competing in the specific tournaments with as their competition. After all, a Bushi isn't going to be matched against a Shugenja for the tournament. Only at the very end, when there is one Bushi, one Courtier, and one Shugenja is there a cross competition that cares about the points themselves.

So if a Shugenja stomps a bushi in sumai, it is rough, but doesn't set them any farther back than a bushi stomping another bushi.

Edit: I am also a bit confused as to why there is so much stress over the Topaz points, as having been posted up since May, the only feedback I had received up until today was that 100 was too much to ask so I lowered it to 75

[Iuchi Prashant]

I also have to propose the question of if we are all jumping the gun here seeing as only 1 day of points have been awarded.

I understand that the longer we wait to make a change, the bigger of a gap there could be and more bad feelings can occur, but it does feel a bit too early to completely scrap my design. I personally worked pretty hard on it and thought it to be fair. Not saying that to be egotistical, or that I am opposed to change, but something to think on.

Also this!

[Otomo Nobuko]

I only disagree in that school techs are always active, so anything that affects a particular area will benefit courtiers/ bushi. Battle Maidens for instance get a flat + Honour for all attack rolls' - that's a +6/7 at least for at least all rolls in two events.

I don't think that's a problem at all, mind. People will be better in some areas, and that's how it goes I guess.

I don't consider those extra buffs. for the most part, they aren't nearly as powerful as saying 'i'm going to get an extra 3k3 to every roll by activating this one spell'.

That said, I do think it's too early to say if that's actually an unfair advantage or not - the +7 for correct choice is the only thing I think should go into effect D3.

If the points begin to show as being unfairly assessed between the three competitor types across the next 3 IC days, we might need a different way of deciding the final winner of the Topaz Championship than straight points. But as for earning them to get into the finals? that's a moot point.

[Isawa Tanshin]

I also have to propose the question of if we are all jumping the gun here seeing as only 1 day of points have been awarded.

Most likely.

By my math, I am about 5 pts shy from gempukku on day 1. Coasting Time!

[Iuchi Prashant]

I only disagree in that school techs are always active, so anything that affects a particular area will benefit courtiers/ bushi. Battle Maidens for instance get a flat + Honour for all attack rolls' - that's a +6/7 at least for at least all rolls in two events.

I don't think that's a problem at all, mind. People will be better in some areas, and that's how it goes I guess.

I don't consider those extra buffs. for the most part, they aren't nearly as powerful as saying 'i'm going to get an extra 3k3 to every roll by activating this one spell'.

That said, I do think it's too early to say if that's actually an unfair advantage or not - the +7 for correct choice is the only thing I think should go into effect D3.

If the points begin to show as being unfairly assessed between the three competitor types across the next 3 IC days, we might need a different way of deciding the final winner of the Topaz Championship than straight points. But as for earning them to get into the finals? that's a moot point.

+3k3 to all rolls has been changed already (if it's the spell that increases int) afaik, but other than that, I completely agree here : )

[Kaito Haruki]

but we're still waiting for fire kami's blessing which can grant up to +5k0. Going to hold my thoughts on this for the good of the game.

[Vutall]

If needed, I can errata Fire Kami's Blessing quite easily.

"The target recieves +xk1, where X is equal to the casters Fire ring, but is limited to a maximum of their Mastery Level + Affinity"

[Mai]

I say leave Topaz Points how they are and come up with another incentive. It could be per Event, like pick the correct Ring and fulfill another condition (make a certain number of raises, double explosions, just "pass" the test, etc.) for the obstacle course, you get climbing equipment that gives you a free raise to Athletics (Climbing).

Or you could do an end of game thing where everyone gets an element point (or something) for using the correct Ring. At the end of game, having X elemental points gets you Y bonus. Or have a few available like the end of Part 1 (though maybe make it buy one only).

Of course, I wouldn't count Day 2 for either of these.

And sorry if someone suggested something similair. I just got on and am trying to catch up.

[Otomo Nobuko]

If needed, I can errata Fire Kami's Blessing quite easily.

"The target recieves +xk1, where X is equal to the casters Fire ring, but is limited to a maximum of their Mastery Level + Affinity"

I think that would be far more fair and in keeping with some of the other restrictions we've gotten due to how high level we are by the numbers.

[Vutall]

Should the incentive at the end of the game for selecting the correct ring (More likely on D6, since that's the celebration feast), assuming it has no effect on topaz points at all, be revealed now, or would players like it to be a surprise?

[Kaito Haruki]

xk1 or xk0 as in raw?

[Isawa Tanshin]

If needed, I can errata Fire Kami's Blessing quite easily.

"The target recieves +xk1, where X is equal to the casters Fire ring, but is limited to a maximum of their Mastery Level + Affinity"

I was rolling 10k6 (I think it should have been 7 with void)
I'm ok with this change. It Levels with the character, so it has some legs. 2 Raises for +1 Kept die?

[Isawa Tanshin]

Should the incentive at the end of the game for selecting the correct ring (More likely on D6, since that's the celebration feast), assuming it has no effect on topaz points at all, be revealed now, or would players like it to be a surprise?

Surprise!

[Otomo Nobuko]

Should the incentive at the end of the game for selecting the correct ring (More likely on D6, since that's the celebration feast), assuming it has no effect on topaz points at all, be revealed now, or would players like it to be a surprise?

Surprise!

[Asako Saburo]

Alright, having looked over commentary thus far, I have a few points. Overall, I am not seeing a major mechanical discrepancy in the arrangement so long as the primary focus of Topaz points is to hit the 75 point threshold in order to enter the second stage of the tournament. I believe that the flat +5 bonus is preferable to the 2x bonus, but I am less of a gambling man myself, so that reflects more of an agreement with Iuchi Prashant's player in this regard.

Regarding Spells:
Ok, we all know Ishiken are powerful things. This was a known factor going in, and things like the banning of "Alter the Course" are almost necessary fixes for overall balance to be maintained. (In these events, it would have less impact, but Alter the Course is still Alter the Course). The more that I've looked over what Saburo was able to do in terms of heraldry, the more that I think that I have a plan going forward for him.

I won't be using "Strengthening the Void" in future events. While +1k0 when void is spent isn't earth shattering it actually had a pretty significant impact on the overall results to be able to turn Sage into a 7k5 with Void. I believe that Saburo already enjoys a significant advantage in being able to utilize Drawing the Void as a recovery spell between events to recover his void at a vastly accelerated rate compared to his other competitors. Anything else is needlessly gravy. He will hit 75 with no issues, and the lily does not need to be gilded, so to speak.

- On "Fire Kami's Blessing," I believe that limiting the bonus to Masteryk0 is the solution that keeps the spell closer to balanced. The spell is designed as a Mastery 1 spell held by Fire 2-3 characters at tier 1 events, which at Insight Rank 3-4 begins to show dominance at 4k0. We are IR 1, which means everyone is enjoying Technique level 1 effects, while certain tricks are significantly altered in unexpected ways by unexpectedly high rings for IR 1. It's an unintended result, much as I think "Strengthening the Void" is causing a more significant impact than I had expected.

- Regarding overall point spreads, based on the mechanics I've seen, I'm expecting to see a considerably larger fluctuation of results in events going forward. there's a lot of things you just can't prepare for, such as the Athletics test's duration, the horsemanship's widely varied skills, the fact that three events are on top of each other, making void blowing more of a risky venture (even for Saburo, there are limits.).

I can certainly understand frustrations in early events, but I will confess that I've taken a "Go with the flow" mentality regarding the mechanics of the game overall.


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Surprise

[Matsu Qiang]

What if we just didn't give extra points for raises/exceptional success? Or only gave +1 for the first raise/exceptional success? Then there'd still be advantage to picking the ring you're "good at" over the ring that's "correct" for the event, but you wouldn't rack up crazy extra topaz points by choosing your highest ring and calling 4 raises or something. (Just an idea, feel free to modify or ignore it.)